Special Guest: Winnie Wang

Where you can find Winnie:

Wholesome Wednesday Community: https://transformationgroup.mn.co/share/URLOGIqLCd5V_BSO
Book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09VJFLBGR
Website: https://www.MindfulHealingHeart.com
Linked In:  https://​​www.linkedin.com/in/WinnieChanWang
Instagram: https://instagram.com/MindfulHealingHeart
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MindfulHealingHeart
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/c/MindfulHealingHeart


[Jon Dabach] 00:00
Today on the relationship Revival Show we have Dr. Winnie Wang Winnie is the queen of compassion and transformation using both science and spirituality. She is a trauma informed licensed acupuncturist, Shadow worker, Reiki and intuitive healer and a professor in acupuncture at Alhambra Medical University. Her clients often have anxiety and depression and feel stuck in their physical or emotional pain. When he is passionate about teaching people how to release the trauma from their bodies.

[Jon Dabach] 00:31
She believes wellness belongs to everyone, regardless of income level, and provides free resources online for everyone to access. I’m excited to pick her brain about the mind body connection. Because even though I live in my body, I don’t know much about it. And I’m fascinated to kind of peel back the curtain and find out exactly what’s going on inside these things that we use to walk around.

[Jon Dabach] 00:54
You’re listening to the relationship revival podcast with Jon Dabach, also known as Mr. Spirituality. That’s me. I’m your host giving you insights and guidance from over 10 years in the field of this amazing journey we call romance on this show, I go over everything you need to know about how to get into a relationship, how to get the most out of a relationship, and sometimes even how to gracefully end a relationship without pulling your hair out and going crazy. And occasionally, I’m even joined by new and old friends who are also relationship experts to bring you guidance and wisdom with new perspectives. Thanks for stopping by. Dr. Weighing weenie Wang, how are you?

[Winnie Wang] 01:37
I’m great. Mr. Spirituality, I’m so excited to be on your show.

[Jon Dabach] 01:42
Thank you for being here. I was, you know, we just had a quick chat before we rolled and I was telling you, you know, we, we haven’t really had a chance on the show yet to talk about the body and the way the body stores trauma, or the way the body deals with stress. And I don’t know what your experiences but relationships can be a little just a little bit stressful. If you’re if you’re in if you’re married and you have a pulse and you haven’t dealt with stress, I would double check that pulse, I think is the right kind of mentality. So before we get started with talking about details, why we don’t give people a little bit I mean, I read your intro. So people kind of know. Give us your story. In your own words, though, how you kind of got to where you are.

[Winnie Wang] 02:32
Yeah, perfect. So in 2009, I had a spinal injury while I was giving birth to my second child, and with a crooked spine, everything. It hurts, right? I have neck pain, lower back pain, hip pain, knee pain, ankle pain, and my organs are all sitting in the wrong place. And because of that physical injury, I then manifested anxiety and depression, right? Because if you imagine, all of a sudden, you can’t sit in a chair for 10 minutes.

[Winnie Wang] 03:06
And that, of course put a lot of stress in my relationship, while all of a sudden I felt like 24/7 victim. Yeah, right. Like I couldn’t. I couldn’t recline and watch a movie. And I felt like a loser. I can’t play tennis like I used to. I can’t do jumping jacks. And I think that, you know, in real life and relationships, sometimes things happen, you know, accidents happen, we lose a job. And you know, when you take the vial and said I Do I Do you don’t really know what you’re getting into, right?

[Jon Dabach] 03:44
Yeah, nobody does. Nobody’s really prepared for this. Tell me right. Before we get into that. Tell me a little bit. So were you born with a spinal, like a crooked spine? Or was it an injury? What?

[Winnie Wang] 03:55
How did that happen? Yeah. So it happened during the labor of my second child.

[Jon Dabach] 04:01
Oh, so I heard of that. That’s so interesting. During labor, one, the pressure of labor the spine went out of whack or how does that happen?

[Winnie Wang] 04:09
Yeah, so basically, I was under a lot of hormones, right? Because the body has to stretch so that the baby can come out. So literally, the hip bones become very flexible. And during that time, because I was lying crooked. So when the hormone stop pumping my my pelvis stayed crooked. Oh, wow. Yeah. So. So it’s interesting because of course, the Body Keeps the Score. And it’s like a chicken or egg thing. Right?

[Winnie Wang] 04:45
So. So it’s like, if I have hip pain, that can cause anxiety, depression, or if I have anxiety and depression, I can manifest hip pain. Right, so one can lead to the other. And in this case, the reason why I manifested this hip pain was because the whole time during my labor, I was so worried about my first child. Right? Because up until that point, she has gone to sleep every night with her Mommy. Oh, yeah.

[Winnie Wang] 05:23
And then I was like, Oh my God, my bait poor baby daughter, she’s gonna be worried. Why did mom just disappear? And you will she was about 21 months old at that time. And I can explain, okay, Mom, we’ll be back in two days, she’s just at the hospital pushing out your baby sister. So because I had so much anxiety, you know,

[Jon Dabach] 05:50
Creating abandonment for your daughter, right? That’s kind of where the anxiety stemmed from.

[Winnie Wang] 05:54
Yeah. So I was kind of creating all kinds of problems. So really, what I want to help all the podcast listener understand is the mind body connection, right? When I am in worry, overthinking, anxiety, fear, anger, any of these emotions, it actually shows up in the body, and vice versa, because I have this chronic illness. Then I started feeling like a victim and having, you know, 24/7 pain, and I took it out on my then ex-husband.

[Jon Dabach] 06:33
And we’re still married, right?

[Winnie Wang] 06:35
Yeah, at that time, we’re still married. But you know, I didn’t know better. Right? And actually, that’s why I now have a service is called sacred union. And, you know, I know you’re a couple counselor, and yeah, I love couple counseling. But sometimes I just want to lie on the massage table. And when I get off from the massage table, it’s like somebody wave a magic wand. And then

[Jon Dabach] 07:06
I’m a big, I’m a big advocate for people getting massage and acupuncture. I think self-care is huge. I recommend it to couples all the time. Absolutely.

[Winnie Wang] 07:16
Yeah. So what I actually specialize in doing is couples work where, you know, the couple both go on the table. But before they go on the table, they say three things that they love about their partner, and one thing that they want to change about their partner, just one thing,

[Jon Dabach] 07:36
You could only pick one.

[Winnie Wang] 07:40
And then so me and my boyfriend who is also, you know, a body worker, a Reiki healer and Shaman. So we would each do the body work and release the trauma from the body. So you know, because in my experience, sometimes when you do couples counseling, it could feel a lot like, oh, you said this, and I said this, and then you did this, and I did this right? And it could feel a lot like bringing up and rehashing the past.

[Winnie Wang] 08:17
When reality the wound goes far beyond our dating life, right? The wounds usually occur between age zero and seven. You know, it’s usually a father wound and the mother wound Yeah. And it’s usually stored in the body. So it’s so fun for me to do this work, because instead of talking about the problem, it’s like okay, everybody just lie on the massage table. Just let me do it. There’s not and then effort there.

[Winnie Wang] 08:49
No, no, just lie down and receive. And you know, me and my partner, you know, we both work on, you know, assuming a heterosexual couple here. Yeah. You know, I work on both the man and the woman and he also works on both the men and the women and so we balance out whatever father mother wooden that you know, the couple come with. And so I love what I do because it’s so complimentary to having you know, a couple of therapists but sometimes you got to work on the mother father wood, but just by lying on the massage table.

[Jon Dabach] 09:30
Yeah. Well, let me ask you what is it? What does it look like is or what is it? What is the experience feel and sound like and feel like to the actual couple? Does it feel like a massage? Is there music playing? Is it more Reiki where it’s noncontact when you say your boyfriend’s a shaman? You know, a lot of people don’t know what that means. is he waving around incense? Are there things being chanted? You know this. You’ve totally sparked my curiosity. Sure.

[Winnie Wang] 09:57
So I think its fun to dive into Story. Okay, study. So okay, so our most recent couple, the the man’s description of the woman is that she always feel not enough. You know, she’s always saying, Oh, I feel fat or, you know, the man says if there’s one thing I want to change about my girlfriend is I wish she knew how beautiful she was. I wish he knew how perfect she was. Right? And then then we asked the woman, okay, what’s the one thing you want to change about the man? She says, I wish he knew how powerful he is. Right?

[Winnie Wang] 10:53
You know, I think that sometimes men they might be serving under their capacity. Okay. Yeah, I see. Right? Sure. So it’s like, you know, the woman sees, you’re meant for bigger things, you know, of course, maybe you can make more money, or you can have a bigger title or promotion or job, but the woman sees that the man has the potential for bigger things. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So.

[Winnie Wang] 11:25
So in this case, you know, then the couple then goes down and lay on the table. And then you know, then I, I work on the woman’s hips, and also stomach organs. In what way? Can you work on it? Exactly. So this is where I bring in the philosophy of the five elements.

[Winnie Wang] 11:51
So for those listeners who don’t know, five elements come from traditional Chinese medicine. So we have word fire, earth, metal, and water. So digestion, is the earth element and the organs related is stomach and spleen, okay. And what that means is, when we overthink, or when we have anxiety, that actually impairs our digestive function. So it’s like,

[Jon Dabach] 12:31
How are they connected? So that’s because one of the things that’s that I truly believe is that there is a mind body connection. But one thing I’ve never understood is, what is the connection? I mean, I know when you’re nervous, everything just feels like its vibrating. You know, but how does that have a direct impact on those organs?

[Winnie Wang] 12:49
Yes, thank you for that question. So it is a chi disorder. Chi means energy. So what that means is, in the medicine textbook, we say that when the person overthinks, it causes chi to tie a knot or bind. So basically, whenever you overthink, you’re causing knots in your abdomen. So that if you have a lot of knots in your abdomen, then you can’t receive. So the stomach Oregon is built for receiving. And when you have knots you can receive. That’s why this is really funny. A lot of women can’t relax and have sex, right? Sometimes I just think, you know, if only the woman can relax and have more sex, then all the couple questions and problems, conflicts will go away. And then

[Jon Dabach] 13:48
I’m saying if women have more sex couples problems wouldn’t exist as much.

[Winnie Wang] 13:55
Yes, yes.

[Jon Dabach] 13:56
I’m gonna repeat that again. So if women have more sex with their partners there, there’d be less issues.

[Jon Dabach] 14:03
Yes, you’re for all the men listening there. I think you just got a standing ovation.

[Winnie Wang] 14:07
So you see that? The secret is if you want to have more sex with your woman, okay, don’t spend time talking about the problems in the relationship. Let’s just go for the pleasure and the relationship. Right. Like, kissing feels good. Hugging feels good. Right, touching. But then the question is, why do a lot of women have a hard time? Relaxing? Right? I’m a doctor. And so when I talk about penis and vagina, please know that this is a medical term. Okay. I’m a professional.

[Jon Dabach] 14:48
I would hope it were using medical terms like that, that it wasn’t anything other than medical. It’s not not super romantic to refer to it those ways. Yes.

[Winnie Wang] 14:56
Okay. So the medical term is what we want the penis to get hard, and we want the vagina to get soft. So what that means is we really want the man to get hard in the sense that he takes on more responsibility, right? He provides the structure that discipline, and he’s taking care of the woman. And so that the woman can just have no worry and the world relaxed and sing and dance and you know, just soften and relax her being. Yeah. And yeah, exactly. So it’s

[Jon Dabach] 15:39
so interesting. We so we had a guest recently, Elliot Katz, who’s really great guy from Canada, who talks about the male role in relationships, and how many to learn to be leaders again, and this kind of plays right into that, you know, when when women don’t have to make decisions, when not that they’re incapable by any means, God forbid, but like, when they don’t feel like that burdens on them, the tension releases, and they can feel more feminine.

[Jon Dabach] 16:08
And now that I’m talking to you, it’s clear that it has a physical impact of physiological impact. So and that brings the intimacy back, because now you’re preparing for physical intimacy, by virtue of the character that you’re taking on as a male and female in the relationship. That’s so beautiful.

[Winnie Wang] 16:30
Yeah, I think that a lot of the problems can be solved without talking. You know, talking is great. I mean, that’s what we’re doing right now we’re having a beautiful conversation. But I believe that 80% of communication is nonverbal. So, you know, verbal communication is great, but you know, touching is great. And bodywork is great. And so I just wished that more people would just get on the table, and just let us serve them.

[Jon Dabach] 17:11
So let’s go back to what that looks like. So you were talking about the case study where the woman wanted him to realize his true potential, which is about him being firm, and on a physical level hard, right, and you wanted the woman he wanted the woman, ironically, to play right into her femininity, which is to stop worrying, stop having knots and just accept that she’s great. Have that confidence, making her softer?

[Jon Dabach] 17:34
So when you say, Okay, we’re going to work on this midsection in the in the stomach? Is it like, what does it feel like? Is it a deep tissue massage? Are you bringing in acupuncture? What are he’s the actual physical mechanism you’re using?

[Winnie Wang] 17:49
Right? So in yoga, we always talk about so mind and body. Right? So when you’re on the table, there is some physical manipulation, and breath work meditation, where simply where you breathe into is where you heal. So I happen to be an acupuncturist. So sometimes I do acupuncture. And you know, I am very a hands on person. But there’s also another component, which is the soul component.

[Winnie Wang] 18:27
So the way I explain the soul because I have computer science degree from MIT, is the sole is like the operating system. Right? So if you have bugs in your operating system, like my iPhone here, if it has bugs, it’s going to crash. So what do we want? We want software updates, right?

[Winnie Wang] 18:54
So then the question is, how we get software updates, so that we can download this improved software so that you don’t just trigger the same place every single time. And so that is the you know, the shamanic work, you know, a lot of times you know, Dr. Gopal Motzei talks about this when a child has to decide between authenticity and attachment. They always pick attachment.

[Winnie Wang] 19:33
So what that means is, imagine your child between ages zero and seven. You can either stay authentic to your truth, or you can stay attached to your mom and dad. And, you know, most children will choose attach to mom and dad. And so in order for them to obey Mom and Dad, please mom and dad, they actually cut are off a part of their soul. It’s kind of like inherit Potter, you know how Voldemort cuts off parts of their soul.

[Winnie Wang] 20:07
So most of us have soul loss between eight, zero and seven. And that’s the childhood trauma. And sometimes working with a shaman, he is calling back the soul that you cut off between ages zero to seven back into your body. And so that is the magical part of this. And it’s so beautiful because all you have to do is lie on the table and say yes, I want my soul back. You know, that part of me that I decided to cut off when I was three years old. Yeah, bring them back. Yeah. So that’s what we do. That’s very cool.

[Jon Dabach] 20:43
You have some language, in you’re in your bio, and everything else that I’ve read about you about shadow work. What is Shadow Work?

[Winnie Wang] 20:54
Yeah, so I’m going to tell you a quick story about my shadow work. So I’ve been a Reiki healer for a couple years, and I’ve always been working with love and light. And then the divorce happened. And then I’m like cuss word when he WTF what does that say about you? You talk about love and light. But what does the data say? What does the report card say? The report card says that you are full of shadows.

[Winnie Wang] 21:24
So, Shadow Work is the process where we willingly dive into the deepest, darkest part of our psyche, with the intention not to dwell on the darkness, but to transform into light. So, you know, I was very fortunate to have my divorce where it literally crushed my ego brought me back down to my knees where I’m like, okay, Winnie, what’s really going on? And there were so many dark nights of the soul, I tell you, where I was like, oh, it’s because I did this, or I said this, you know, and you know, the phrase, everyone is our mirror.

[Winnie Wang] 22:14
It’s true. Okay, everything I ever complain about my ex-husband, it’s in me. So one of my top complaints I say he’s selfish. I’m selfish, right? I say. He is very judgmental. I’m very judgmental. You know, I say that. He is not able to listen to me while I’m not able to listen to him. So basically, one day, I wrote down everything I ever complained about my husband, then I cross out the he and put I and I read that back to myself. I’m like, Oh my gosh, that you know, everything I don’t like about my husband and why I needed a divorce isn’t me.

[Winnie Wang] 23:06
And the most rewarding part of this is once I can own how I’m an I have anger issues. I’m critical. I’m judgmental. I’m selfish. I don’t listen. And once I do the work of transforming my shadow, it led to the most beautiful relationship ever. And so now I am enjoying more. Yes, more sex, but also just more pleasure in life more trust. More engagement, you know, it’s really, you know, now I feel like when I say I have some love to give, its real love. It’s not that calculated love. You know, before I did the shadow work. It’s like this, I would secretly keep tap like an Excel spreadsheet. Okay, I gave x units of time and x units of love.

[Winnie Wang] 24:10
And let’s see how much did you give that back to me? Right, like keeping my loved keeping score. Exactly. I was a healthy habit. No, I was so keeping score. And my love was so conditional. And I was a resentful monster.

[Jon Dabach] 24:31
So how do you do what what is the shadow? So I think I kind of get what the shadows are. What’s the shadow work? What’s the how do you work on it?

[Winnie Wang] 24:40
Yeah, so I actually wrote a book called honoring darkness, embrace shadow work to nourish and grow your power. Because what I found because I’m a nerdy professor, and I’m used to teaching curriculums with you know, a syllabus and you know, stuff lecture was that sometimes people can go to their talk therapist and 20 years, yeah, they still have a talk therapist is still on their antidepressants.

[Winnie Wang] 25:13
And what I really want to do is give people a structure a program, you know, you just buy the book and you do the exercises at the end of every chapter. And then now you have a solid foundation to what shadow work is about.

[Jon Dabach] 25:34
Got it. Got it. So you read the book, and you kind of understand how to work through those dark places, and how to approach fixing them in your life. So there’s a kind of a regimented process and how you do it.

[Winnie Wang] 25:47
Exactly. But the best part, is this fun, you know, I, a lot of people are like, Well, why would I want to go look at my monster? And the answer is, well, there is you can look at healing, like, I got to show up to my couple, counselor, I got to go to therapy. Or you can look at life, just like playing video games. Right? So every day. Yeah, exactly. So I think that as a culture, we’re so attached to outcome, right? It’s like having sex.

[Winnie Wang] 26:33
We got to reach orgasm or ejaculation. You know, if we don’t ejaculate as if we didn’t have sex, like people are so attached to crossing the finish line, as opposed to Whoa, what? Let’s just explore the body. You know, what if? Let’s say I’m a man? What if I just stroke her hair? With no expectation of where that’s going to go? Right? What if I just massage her calves? With no expectation of what that will turn into? Right? What if I just massage her shoulders? With no attachment to where that’s going to lead? What if I just touched her with an open mind to talking?

[Jon Dabach] 27:23
About being involved in the process? Is that what exactly so like the game was not about finishing the game? It’s about playing the game? Yeah,

[Winnie Wang] 27:33
Exactly. So what if we don’t think about healing? Like, there is an end goal? Yeah. But we’re just in it. Because the process is beautiful. It’s like the flowers on the journey are beautiful. What if you can derive pleasure from giving the massage on the calves or the shoulder? You know, what if you can derive pleasure just from sniffing her hair?

[Winnie Wang] 28:05
Right, just kind of slowing down? Instead of always, well, you know, if I can get her to, you know, excuse my language, but open her legs and take off her underwear that’s like, you know, like, what if we just approach life with more of this? Wonder and curiosity? Yeah,

[Jon Dabach] 28:25
I couldn’t agree with you more. I mean, there’s, there’s a lot of neurological evidence that when you are outcome focused, that you actually are teaching yourself to hold a certain amount of resentment in the of the process, because it’s only about the outcome.

[Jon Dabach] 28:42
But if you can trick your brain and kind of learn to embrace the process, and the outcome is just a side benefit, you know, like another but like the cherry on top of the ice cream, then you get addicted to it. People who do this with exercise, even not just intimacy, where they actually learn to, like, the process of working out, tend to stay much longer, and tend to do it much more, you know, regularly than someone who’s just about I need to lose 10 pounds, or I need to gain a certain muscle mass.

[Jon Dabach] 29:13
The people who learn to enjoy the process, have a longevity that just smokes everybody else. So I couldn’t and I think you’re right and doing this with yourself and your shadow work doing this, in your partnership with your with your romance is a beautiful thing to aspire to. Absolutely.

[Winnie Wang] 29:33
And, you know, John, you really hit upon this word that I love, which is longevity, you know, and I like to add the word sustainability, right. So, when we enter relationships, hopefully we’re not just dating for three months. Yeah, right. Hopefully the relationship lasts Right. And how do we make relationship class. And as it turns out, we do that by having less ego attachment.

[Winnie Wang] 30:10
Like I have to have my way it’s my way or the highway. Right? Right. It’s like, well, you know, I care more about our connection than being right. You know, that’s why I don’t want my couples to come in here and talk too much. Because when you talk, you use your brain to formulate sentences. I just want them to experience love. Right, and the love is, when we care more about the love and the connection, and less about being right, then that is the key ingredient to making a relationship last and sustainable.

[Jon Dabach] 30:59
Yeah, I think you’re right. I think there are more people when they come in, especially into couples counseling, we work on, we work on the conflicts, we work on the communication, but I always try and encourage people outside of the sessions, to go and do something where they can just enjoy each other, whether they’re talking or not something where they can reconnect, because there’s the fights will be there, you know, they’re going to come no matter what, there’s no such thing as a couple that doesn’t fight that actually has real connection, that just doesn’t, I mean, you could have no fights with the stranger doesn’t mean that you’re in a relationship.

[Jon Dabach] 31:37
But they’re there waiting for you while they’re waiting, go experience the benefit of being in a relationship, the love surround yourself in a way that it speaks to you. And I think, you know, that’s why I, I work with people who have individual therapists, and then they come in for couples counseling, and I tell them, you should go do yoga. I mean, there’s so many different ways to connect.

[Jon Dabach] 31:59
And I think what you’re doing sounds really interesting. I want to I wanted to ask you a question does, again, this is me just being fascinated with the body? Because I don’t have any background in the physical world at all. So when you have disharmony and when you have tension in a relationship, does it get stored somewhere specifically in the body? Or does it kind of go all over the place?


[Jon Dabach] 32:23
And then what do you do as a doctor? What do you do to kind of release it? Do you use acupuncture? And how does that work? Because it’s, to me, it’s, you know, especially because I was born with Western medicine mentality, it all seems like magic. It’s just like, okay, someone’s going to wave a magic wand or someone sticks the needle up here. And then somehow, my nerves are all connected.

[Jon Dabach] 32:44
And it says, released, like, I still don’t quite understand the concept. I do know, when my wife goes to acupuncture, she comes back a better woman. So I know. I know it works. But I don’t know how and I’m so fascinated. So specifically, just too kind of I know, it’s a long winded question, but where does the trauma gets stored? And how do you release it?

[Winnie Wang] 33:04
Sure. That’s an excellent question. So every acupuncture is in the state of California, just because we’re here. It’s a four year medical degree. So we are trained to diagnose where the problem is. So I can’t tell you Okay, well, all the relationship trauma is stored in the uterus or the hips, but, you know, that’s why everybody should pull out their Yelp and find the nearest acupuncturist and go get a professional diagnosis. The best way that I can explain how it works is every day we have a lot of toxins, right?

[Winnie Wang] 33:46
You brush your teeth twice a day. Getting an acupuncturist is like having your system cleaned regularly. Right. So in my humble opinion, even if you’re, you have perfect teeth, you should get deep cleaning twice a year, I go to a dentist, it’s like everybody should go to an acupuncturist once a month, that’s just like flushing your toilet. Okay, that’s when everything is working.

[Winnie Wang] 34:13
You should see an acupuncturist once a month, but when you’re having an active episode of anxiety or hip pain, then you should actually consider seeing an acupuncturist, maybe two or three times per week for you know 10 session so that you can actually see the results. Right? So imagine that one of the toilets in your house is clogged. It’s actually stinky, and you know that stinky is not pleasant for you.

[Winnie Wang] 34:48
And it’s definitely not pleasant for your spouse either. So when I talked about how I had anxiety, and then I just didn’t see an error Posterous at that time, I took it out on my then ex-husband, okay, don’t do that. You know, yes, get the help you need. And so really, when you see an acupuncturist, they provide the diagnosis of like, which parts of your body have a clogged bathroom, and then the, it’s like hiring a plumber, they give you a special diagnosis, and restore all the plumbing, so that you are an abundant flowing individual again.

[Jon Dabach] 35:33
So how does it work? So when you’re putting a needle in from acupuncture? Is it connecting to the nerve as well as the energy? And how does a needle in a specific part of your body allow toxins to release just on a very basic level?


[Winnie Wang] 35:52
Okay, so on a very basic level. Here’s a cell, right, so the cell will increase and decrease in size, every time you breathe, right. So every time you breathe, it increase and decrease in size. And what is energy, energy is the space between the cells. So in other words, scientifically, there’s an inverse relationship, right, as the cell increases, then the space decreases. So if you just do yoga, or practice breath work regularly, or Chi Gong, then your cells are expanding and contracting in equilibrium.

[Winnie Wang] 36:39
Okay, so that is the healthy state. But when we have thoughts, when we’re stuck in anger, grief, fear, when we are stuck in our trauma, the victim stories, then this mechanism of increasing and decreasing is off. And actually, that’s how cancer cells get formed. Cancer is like a cell that gets bigger, bigger, bigger, because it doesn’t know to try, you know, contract and expand. So there are two ways to heal. Okay.

[Winnie Wang] 37:12
One is, you know, if you go on YouTube, and you do Qigong, and yoga every day for 30 minutes, then you don’t even need an acupuncturist, because your own breath work can restore you back to balance. But when you go lie down on the table, it’s like, just so much faster, because that person can identify where the equilibrium is off, and then signal the body, okay, bring equilibrium back to this, this part and then you you’re the cell will increase and decrease in size,

[Jon Dabach] 37:47
When you put the needle, the acupuncture needle into that part of the body that creates like a signal to the body to restore equilibrium. Is that what’s going on?

[Winnie Wang] 37:58
Yeah, actually, you know, I’m sure maybe some of the audience have heard of EFT Emotional Freedom Technique where they’re just tapping parts of their body. So you know what, actually, you don’t even need needles, okay, I can use fingers and tap my body and where your tap is where the energy goes. Got it. So you know. So for example, if I have headaches, I can just put my hand here and breathe like I don’t, you know,

[Jon Dabach] 38:31
Subconsciously, right. If we have pain somewhere, we put our hand there, because we’re trying to draw the energy into that space. So the body has an amazing way of healing itself. Sometimes it just needs that direction of pressure or puncture or something. Is that what you’re saying?

[Winnie Wang] 38:48
Yeah, so you know, nobody needs acupuncture because you can heal yourself. But acupuncture is where you get to just lie down and do nothing. And all the work is done for you. It’s like

[Jon Dabach] 39:03
Liposuction versus exercise, right? It’s like you can go to the gym and work for 40 minutes a day and maybe lose the weight or you could lay down on the table and have someone suck out the fence. So acupuncture is that shortcut, where you get to lay down and it’s kind of done passively for you.

[Winnie Wang] 39:19
Right so so that all the blockages in your body can be flushed. It’s like having somebody clean your pipes, if you will.

[Jon Dabach] 39:29
Beautiful, beautiful. I’m so glad I had you on me felt like it was education and a half. I know you have your website mindful healing heart, but you also have a community online where you where you kind of share more wisdom. Why don’t you tell people how they can find that? I’ll put the link in the show notes. But is there a kind of a shortcut way they can kind of discover that?

[Winnie Wang] 39:56
Yeah, the easiest way is just go to my I’m for healing heart.com/community. Or you can use the navigation to click on community. And one of the things that I’m really passionate about, as you know, a doctor is, let’s admit it, our country has a broken healthcare system, right? It’s like something people have great health insurance, some people don’t have great health insurance.

[Winnie Wang] 40:24
And my private sessions are, you know, a little bit on the high end side, but I really believe that wellness belongs to the people. Right? So it’s like, I want to share a lot of free content on YouTube on social media, and also have a portal where people can talk to me and ask me questions. And then I can answer them to the whole community, because one person’s question could be 40 benefit 40 other people, right?

[Winnie Wang] 40:58
So I really wanted a platform, where if you got medical issue, you can write to me and I will reply to everyone. So let’s do this. Yeah, this platform is called compassionate transformation. Because we can all transform a relationship or health or financial blockages together. But the first ingredient is compassion. Right? Because, you know, Martin Luther King says, Hate cannot drive out darkness. Only love can. Right.

[Winnie Wang] 41:35
So we can’t transform the relationship by hating who I am. I can’t transform by hating who my partner is i i can’t transform the relationship by hating where the relationship is right now. Yeah. Right. How we’re going to bring change is to have compassion. You know, if you had the childhood that I have, of course, it makes sense that I would behave the way that I do. And if my ex-husband had the childhood that he had, I have compassion that of course, he’s going to behave the way that he did. Right?

[Winnie Wang] 42:14
So the first ingredient is compassion where you’re like, well, it makes so much sense to me, given your childhood, of course, that is the way that you show up on the relationship. So instead of coming with this judgmental and critical energy that I used to be full of, is to come with compassion. Yeah, it makes sense to me that you’re this way and I’m this way, but let’s do it together.


[Jon Dabach] 42:40
I love that. Dr. Winnie weighing thank you so much for joining us. You can find more at mindful healing heart.com you can also find her book on Amazon. Thanks again for being here. It was so educational, and I know you helped a lot of people just by sharing your wisdom and I am excited to see you doing that more and more online.

[Jon Dabach] 43:03
If you’re interested in learning how to get the absolute most out of your romantic relationships then you’re in luck because I have put together a free workshop or masterclass if you will, about three secrets that people in happy relationships have discovered. You can view the workshop and mister spirituality.com/three secrets again, it’s completely free. Just go there and watch it. It’ll help you on your journey give you some wisdoms and things to think about. The website again is Mr. spirituality.com/three secrets. That’s mrspirituality.com/the Number three, the word secrets. It’s all yours. Enjoy.


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